TIME & DATE FIELD NOT WORKING

[pinkcadillac]

I don’t know what I’m doing wrong but I want to sort my records as per the time and date that they placed their order and then the last name of the client.

I’ve always had a latest order (Date field) (a bright green rectangle and that works very well but I’ve also now put a Date and Time field onto my form (a bright green square to the right of the Date field.

I believe it’s set up in Sort and Group Settings correctly but the Date and Time field isn’t being ‘populated’ so I’m back to simply having my clients sorted by date and name only.

This means that, say, Wood, Scott and Brendan who all ordered on 8th September, will appear in alphabetical order (as above) with the Latest Order (Date field showing just today’s date. However, Scott was the last to order today and Wood was the first so I want my sort to read Wood, followed by Brendan and then Scott on the top of the list.

Any ideas as to how to do this simple task? I don’t have to know the time they ordered, just who ordered after whom on that one day. Thanks

PS. I don’t want to mess about with my Latest Order (Date only field) in case I lose all that data which goes back nearly a decade!

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[Daniel Leu]

PS. I don’t want to mess about with my Latest Order (Date only field) in case I lose all that data which goes back nearly a decade!

Independent of this, you make backups, don’t you? https://www.tapforms.com/help-mac/5.3/en/topic/backup-restore?q=backup

[pinkcadillac]

Yes I most certainly do! On quit.

[Brendan]

Hi,

So you’re first sorting by Latest Order. Then within that grouping of records you’re sorting by your Date & Time field. And then within that grouping of records you’re sorting by the Last Name.

Sorting in Tap Forms is hierarchical. So you want to pick something that’s most general for the first level, then something that’s a bit more specific for the next level, and then a bit more specific for the third level. And really you don’t often need to sort by 3 levels as it rarely makes much of a difference. But it really depends on your data.

Date & Time fields contain accuracy down to the second. So for any sorting below that to have any kind of affect, there would have to be multiple orders placed at exactly the same second. If that were the case, then the sorting by Last Name would then be done alphabetically.

So in reality, you really don’t need that third sort field. Nor the second. If all you want to do is to be able to see a list of records based on the date and time they ordered, you really probably just need to have the First Sort Field set to your Date & Time field and leave the other sort fields set to unspecified.

Then you would know exactly who placed their order first, then second, then third, and so on.

Thanks,

Brendan

[pinkcadillac]

Great! that makes sense and I’ve done what you suggest, sorting by Time & Date and then by Latest Order and then Unspecified.

However, I’m afraid the T & D field still isn’t being filled in/populated.I’ve deleted it and re-installed it but nothing.

Don’t know if this is relevant or not but up til now I’ve entered the current date manually then, say after a month or 2 when the client orders again, I search for their record and update that field, again manually, obviously with today’s current date.

Would it be better perhaps just to use the new T & D and do without the Latest Order (Date field) all together?

Of course this would rely on me getting it to work and be populated in the first place (!).

Presumably it fills in/changes the current date each time I pull up and edit that client’s record with the details of that new order?

But if I delete the Latest Order (Date field) aren’t I going to lose the order date from all of my 2000 clients prior to making this change?

Also, I may sometimes want to simply look up something in that record and NOT change the date at all ie. there may not be a new order to add.

I’m sure there’s an easy fix to this as it must be a very common requirement in a sales database.

Thanks,

[Daniel Leu]

Presumably it fills in/changes the current date each time I pull up and edit that client’s record with the details of that new order?

That would be a different field type. It is called Date Modified and is at the bottom of the field list.

Just add the Date Modified field as as a new field and KEEP your current Date field. There is no need to delete it or change its type to something else.

• This reply was modified 2 years, 7 months ago by Daniel Leu.

[pinkcadillac]

Hi Daniel, thank you for being so very prompt!
But I don’t want to change the date (for sorting reasons) if all I’ve done is look something up on the record, I only want it to change if I actually edit its details because it’s a new order.

What you’ve kindly suggested sounds to me like every time I open up a record (just to check something) its Date Modified would change too and so, say, Brendan’s name would appear at the top of my records list when he hadn’t in fact ordered anything!

I wouldn’t want to sort my records by Date Modified which brings me back to how to sort by the date and time of my latest order.

Why isn’t this field populating anyway?

Thanks and apologies if this is becoming burdensome!

[Daniel Leu]

Just opening a record will not update the Date Modified field. You always can add a new field and see how it works. In the worst case, you can delete at again.

The Time & Date field is populated by you. Click on the calendar icon to set the date and time.

[pinkcadillac]

OK! I get it now!

I understand the difference between DM and D&T and of course can add both and play around with them. I didn’t understand before that I had to fill in the time and ate manually – not a problem but….. trouble is I haven’t got a calendar next to my T&D field and where do I find a DM field – there isn’t one on my file?

[Sam Moffatt]

Date Created, Date Modified and Modified By Device are managed by Tap Forms and aren’t user editable fields.

You can also set your date/time field to automatically set current date when a record is created as a default value. If you are contemporaneously creating records then it will have the right value automatically. You could also use the Date Created field if you don’t need to update it later (e.g. you will always create a record at the right time and never have to back date it). I personally use a date/time with set current date for stuff I intend on being contemporaneous because sometimes I forgot or miss something and have to back enter data.

[pinkcadillac]

Dear Sam and Daniel,

You’re both being so helpful but I must admit I’m getting more and more confused. I’m not an IT expert but I do use TF many times every day and couldn’t be without it for my work and I learned it myself as it’s so user friendly.

To recap….I already have a date field which populates itself and that date remains eg. 7th August, 2021, until and unless I manually change it when that client places her next order, say today, so I manually change it to 9th September, 2021.

However, and this really is such a small thing, if 10 clients place orders today, then I’d like the record list to be in chronological order rather than how I have it now which is purely alphabetical within today’s date.

I learned that there’s a Date AND TIME field which I’ve now added but it doesn’t self populate unless it’s a brand new record. If I understand correctly Daniel says it has to be done manually and that there’s a calendar icon for this (mine hasn’t got one) whilst Sam tells me it’s can’t be edited by me.

Enter Daniel’s field called Date Modified which it seems will alter every time I open that record. That’s no good for me because I may simply be looking something up, not entering a new order from my client, so I don’t want the date that’s there to change.

I don’t really need to see this date and time, I only want it to sort today’s 10 clients into chronological order. I already have, albeit manually, the date I want to keep or to update when the client orders next.

So where can I get the “Calendar” bit of the T&D field which is missing, where can I get any new fields which are not already on my files? I’ll play around with them, until I find the one which sorts my clients’ names chronologically, whether they’re new to me or old clients repeating an order?

Sorry to make this so laborious for everyone.

[pinkcadillac]

OK guys, I think I’ve done it!
I manually enter the date and time in a new date and time field. there’s no calendar to click on so I simply type 10 September 2021 00.19.

I filled in the “order placement time” for about 20 records and they now appear in the correct and desired chronological order because I set the hierarchies in Sort to be:-
1. My Latest Order (date field) which I will keep as it is.
2. My new Date and Time
3. The client’s last name

Were I setting up this file up from scratch I wouldn’t need No.1 or No. 3 but simply let the date and time be the only sort factor. However, this file spans 2000 clients and a number of years. If Mr. Brown reorders after 3 years I want to see when he last ordered so I need to retain my original Date field (Latest Order).
I can’t go back and input all 2000 times so I can’t rely on sorting without using my original 1. and 3.

I’ve tested it and it works.

I’ve also found that changing a New Field gives me a list of all sorts of fields so I’ve found out where those other Date Created, date Modified etc fields are lurking.

Last question, where’s that pesky calendar that Daniels says comes with the D&T field?

Thank you every one, including Brendan, for your help and patience.

[Daniel Leu]

Nice to see that there is progress!

But just a clarification: Date Modified does NOT change when you open a record! It only changes when an entry is modified.

And the image shows the calendar symbol I was talking about.

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[pinkcadillac]

Hi Daniel, Oh in that Default Layout view I can see it – I always work in the FORM view as it’s pretty with all my colours and layouts!!

So we now understand eachother. Maybe tomorrow I’ll set up a DM field and have a play with it.

Thank you for all your help, really.

[Daniel Leu]

It is there as well. Don’t know why it doesn’t show for you.

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[Sam Moffatt]

Enable “show accessory controls” on the layout panel for your layout to see the calendar icon.

You could probably use a quick form script to copy the date across to your new field if you want to use it exclusively.

[pinkcadillac]

Wow Sam, that was the missing bit and it works perfectly and is far quicker to click “Now” than to type out the current date and exact time.

Many, many thanks.

I’ve no idea about scripts but this fixed it for me.

I’ll retain both my old Date field (using it’s calendar accessory) for historic orders and use the new T&D with it’s calendar from now on.

My Sorting is sorted too!

Great – thank you everyone!

PS is there a link to a file/doc/record which has all the possible TF fields and can it be added to my TF?

[Daniel Leu]

Ahh… didn’t know about this configuration option. Great that everything is working now!

Here is the link to the field types documentation: https://www.tapforms.com/help-mac/5.3/en/topic/field-types

[pinkcadillac]

Can I download these fields and keep them somewhere on file for future use?

Presumably they come with TF but I don’t seem to have them.

[Daniel Leu]

You can download the entire documentation as a PDF or just keep the link to the online documentation.

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[Brendan]

Under the Help menu is a link to the online user manual. So you’ll always have access to it from there too.

And when you create a new field, the Field Types popup button shows every field type that Tap Forms supports.

Glad you found the Show accessory controls option.

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