Continuing Problems with iCloud Sync

[ictapforms]

I have TF on my iPhone 5, iPod, iPad and MBP. I have been experiencing problems with syncing since the upgrade and was hoping that the release by Apple of the OSX TF upgrade would solve them.

Sadly, this is not the case.

Since the OSX upgrade, on my iPod, loading TF leads to it showing “Syncing” and then locking up. I tried resetting the iPod, resetting TF, and even unloading TF entirely and downloading it again from the App store. Now it just freezes as soon as I load TF.

I’m running iOS 6.0.1 on all of my iDevices and Lion on my MBP.

I’m a patient man, but this whole process has become remarkably frustrating and I need a viable resolution.

You may recall that I first wrote about my problems with syncing the day after you released the iOS upgrade. I have been struggling with this since then.

Please help! This is such a useful product – when it works.

[Brendan]

How long did you wait for the Syncing to be on screen? I’m not sure how big your database is or the extent of the changes that are pending in iCloud, but it might take a while for it to finish up what it’s doing.

When you say it freezes, what happens? Does it eventually kick you back out to the home screen after launching? If that’s the case can you plug into iTunes and check to see if you see a journal file in the Tap Forms Documents area in iTunes File Sharing?

[sunshine]

Hi Brendan,

Since upgrading to v3.1 on my iPhone my iCloud sync is broken again. Changes made on my phone sync back to my Mac. Changes on my Mac do not sync to my phone. I’ve tried every form of reset, including deleting the Ubiquity folder and Tap Forms folder within App Support? Containers… Can’t get it to play ball. Any ideas?

Thanks

[jsutton]

I have Iphone/Ipad version 3.1 and Mac version 1.0.2. I absolutely can not sync. Creating a new form on the mac does not show up on the iphone. Changing a forms name on the mac does not show up on the Iphone. Removing the application from the iphone and reinstalling it does not pick up any of these changes either. I really want this product to sync!

[sunshine]

Meant to include that my Mac version is 1.0.2… My happy syncing days were short lived after it’s release…

[Brendan]

Hello Sunshine,

Hmm.. I did not make any changes to that process in the 3.1 update. What I’m not sure about is if you’re seeing the “Processing Changes from iCloud” message appear on your iPhone or iPad in the status bar area sometime after you click the Sync Now button on the Mac. Are you seeing that and it’s just not having any effect when the sync is done, or is that part just not happening at all?

And are you still seeing all your devices listed in the list of Registered Devices on each device?

Thanks,

Brendan

[sunshine]

Hi Brendan,

Strangely, when I sync from my Mac this triggers the sync dialogue on my phone but the new data does not appear. I’ve tried various combinations: new record from mac, change to existing record on mac, new record from phone (this) appears on mac, change to new record on mac created on phone (change does not appear on phone)…

I get the feeling that data is syncing okay, but not being displayed in 3.1…

Regards

[veritejustice]

Well it look like we all have the same problem… I try everything but Tf do not sync with iCloud here also in Mtl :( My Ipad and iPhone show that it is syncing but nothing appears…. Please Bandran help us out ;-)

[Brendan]

I have been investigating this issue today and I’m still not sure what’s causing it as I cannot reproduce the problem. I’ve taken a clean database on my Mac and iPhone and syncing is working between them. If I add a new form, it shows up on the other device. If I delete a record, it gets deleted on the other device, etc.

So I’m still looking into this issue.

Thanks,

Brendan

[Brendan]

Ok, after further testing, it seems there is some strange sync problem going on from Mac to iOS. But from iOS to Mac seems to be working.

I’m still investigating the cause of this.

By the way, I submitted Tap Forms Mac 1.1 to Apple on December 9th. So still waiting for review.

Thanks,

Brendan

[newt]

Brendan,
I do experience the same problems. I have latest versions on all devices. I used Tap Forms on iPhone 4s and created two forms (from which I only use one). I created some entries and they synced without problems with my OSX Mountain Lion. Vice versa. (Probably relatively short strings). This worked (I suggest at least) a few days. Both devices have the same amount of entries (77). Today I entered 22 entries with my Mac and pressed syncing on Mac, immediately notification showed up on iphone but no new entries appeared. I then clicked sync on iPhone … no success. I disabled sync on iPhone and reenabled and it told me it would sync, and some notifications showed suggesting that all would work. But the new entries still didn’t show up on iPhone. Then I entered one new entry on Mac (Mac has 100 entries now) but there doesn’t show notification on iPhone anymore.

Interesting is: on iPhone it shows the following: registered devices: Mac: last sync 17.12 23:37, iPhone: sync 17.12. 23:37
But when I open sync dialog on Mac:
there shows: registered devices: iPhone: last sync: NO ENTRY, Mac: last sync: 17.12 23:37

Could it be some of the following: Charset problem, Firewall, slow internet that Tap Forms on Mac not gracefully handles, long first field with more than 500 or 1000 chars,….

Please help. I have put important infrastructure on Tap Forms.

[newt]

Now I pressed sync once again on iPhone and now iPhone only has 73 entries. There are 4 missing now. This is a very serious problem.

Is the entry id identical with a form field or does it have a unique increment or still better a unix time stamp, so there get no entries overwritten?

I would appreciate to see a spinning wheel or something on the Mac showing the duration of syncing to iCloud. I have 1MB file size for database that takes with slow internet about five minutes to upload … so I would like to feel, if the process works.

Thanks

[rleathen]

Brendan I too am experiencing this incredibly frustrating problem. Like the others I have tried everything to get my iphone, ipad and mac synced but alas it is not to be. TF on my mac displays the syncing dialog box saying that it is sync’ing but that’s it, it appears to have hung. I have the most recent versions of TF on all my devices.

Brendan I have said it before, your product is exactly what I have been looking for but I need a product that will reliably sync between my 3 devices. When my business relies on being able to access critical information stored in TF and I can’t access it, I have to really consider if TF is the ideal product for me.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE correct this most recent problem and restore my faith (and I am sure others) in your product!!

Rob

[mrGadjet]

For me it seems to be a odd problem. Everything added/edited on the ipad/iphone goes thrugh to imac/mbp but not the other way.

Seem to work between ipad/iphone and in reverse.

Seem to go from imac to mbp and back.

But as i said not from macos to ios.

Regards matt

[Brendan]

Is this still happening even with the latest 1.1 update for Mac that came out today? I’ve been testing with the release versions and I get syncing in both directions now.

Brendan

[jsutton]

This is still happening. I have the 3.1 version for IOS and 1.1 for MacOS. I added a record to an existing form on the MacOS machine, “sync’d” it to the cloud and the form nor new record do not show up on the IOS version. Note that the form would not show up on the IOS version prior to the 3.1/1.1 updates.

[Brendan]

Do a Reset iCloud Sync on your iOS device. Then turn on iCloud sync again then click on the Sync Now button on the Mac. Your new records should come over again.

Brendan

[sunshine]

Hi Brendan,

Sync now appears to be working well with v1.1. However, records created with the previous Mac version do not sync across, but all records created with v1.1 sync perfectly. Records created via an iPhone also sync just fine – old and new.

Regards

[rleathen]

Brendan I have updated to 1.1 on my mac (Iphone and ipad at latest release as well) and continue to experience serious problems with syncing. Unfortunately now when I try to sync TF on my mac it displays the syncing progress bar and hangs…..I let it run for close to 1 hour before forcing TF on the mac.

Any suggestions?

Rob

[jsutton]

Brandon,

I followed your instructions and syncing of the form that I had issues with now syncs. I assume that you would call it a best practice to do this every time that you update either the IOS or OSX version of the app. Correct?

I did some more testing using the following use cases and results:

1) Close tapforms on the mac air ( ensure that TF is not running ). Open tapforms on IOS device.
– Create “New Form” on IOS and add necessary fields.
Observation: The “New Form” does not show up when listing all forms with the Forms Icon lower left. The “New Form” does show up when you go to tools, customize forms.
– Sync IOS device to the cloud.
– Open TF on the Mac Air and sync now.
Observation: The “New Form” created in IOS does not show up.

2) Close TF on IOS. Open TF on Mac Air
– Create new form on Mac Air and sync to the cloud
– Open TF on IOS
– Sync
Observation: This form shows up on IOS

3) Add record on Mac Air TF
– Sync to cloud
– Sync IOS
Observation: The new record shows up in IOS TF

4) Modify record on Mac Air TF
– Sync to cloud
– Sync IOS
Observation: Record change in sync with both devices

5) Modify record on IOS TF
– Sync to cloud
– Sync Mac Air TF
Observation: Record change in sync with both devices

6) Close Mac Air TF.
– Create new record on IOS TF
– Sync to cloud
– Open Mac Air TF
– Sync to cloud
Observation: New record does not show up on Mac Air TF

7) Open TF on both IOS and OSX
– Delete record on IOS that also exists in OSX
– Sync IOS TF to Cloud
– Sync OSX TF
Observation: Record is deleted on both devices for the form

8) Close TF on OSX. Open TF on IOS
– Delete record on IOS that also exists on OSX
– Sync IOS TF to the cloud
– Open OSX TF
– Sync to cloud
Observation: The record deleted on IOS is not deleted from OSX

Hopefully this helps the debugging process. As mentioned before, I really like the app and want to be able to “Trust” the system for production like data and processing.

[Brendan]

Hello J,

One of the problems I see with the steps you’ve done is you’re not giving iCloud a chance to sync the files. You tap sync on one device, then click sync on the other device right after. But that might only just mess up the process or make you think that it’s not syncing properly. You only need to click or tap the sync button on one device at a time. That is, click the Sync Now button on the Mac and wait for the iOS devices to automatically do a sync. There’s no need to tap on the sync button on the iOS devices until they’ve done an automatic sync.

Tap Forms uses a manual push, automatic pull process. That means if you make a change on one device, you push those changes to iCloud, then wait for iCloud to copy the files to the other devices. Tap Forms will get notified when the files are ready for it to process. Then you’ll see the “Processing Changes from iCloud” on your iOS devices appear automatically. On the Mac it just says Syncing briefly because it happens so fast on the Mac side.

Let me know if modifying your process to allow iCloud time to properly sync the files and for Tap Forms to process those files automatically improves your success rate.

In the last update it was necessary to do a Reset iCloud Sync this one time because the database schema was updated on the Mac version to match the iOS version.

Thanks,

Brendan

[andrel42]

My apologies Brendan, sync now works as described so thank you !
Andre

[Brendan]

I was just screen sharing with a customer and explaining the whole process to him. When we tapped on the Reset iCloud sync button, it took over 5 minutes for that change to appear on his Mac. That part of the process is completely out of Tap Forms control. That is, once you’ve tapped on something such as the Reset iCloud Sync button or you’ve tapped on the Sync Now button (on either device), that change must be propagated to the other devices by iCloud itself. Tap Forms merely updates files in a folder on your device and it’s up to the operating system to take over from there. I’ve seen it take 20 minutes for a device to be registered. Not from anything that I’m doing wrong or slow code or anything, but from the operating system taking that long to send the file to iCloud or for the other devices to download from iCloud.

So that’s why it’s important to let iCloud do its thing and to not be too over zealous in tapping on the Sync buttons in Tap Forms. It’s best to just do one sync at a time. Once that is followed you’ll find that syncing goes much smoother.

I hope to add an automatic push in a future update at some point. But even if I did, changes wouldn’t happen on your other devices immediately because it can take time for the operating system to sync the files I create with iCloud.

Thanks,

Brendan

[rleathen]

Brendan I have tried what you have suggested and let TF on my mac take its time to sync…….NO LUCK !! It was “sync’ing” for over 3 hours before I finally forced it. You really need to figure out these sync’ing issues to ensure that TF remains a useable and trustworthy product.

Please do you have any other suggestions ???

Rob

p.s. Yes all IOS devices and my mac have the most recent versions of TF

[Brendan]

Hi Rob,

I haven’t experienced the hanging while syncing issue. I’ve done hundreds of syncs and never once has it hung on me doing that. I suspect it could be something up with the iCloud folder that’s assigned to Tap Forms on your account.

Try this:

1. First make a backup of all your Tap Forms data on each device.
2. Go to the iCloud Sync settings in Tap Forms and tap on Reset iCloud Sync. Do this while all devices have Tap Forms launched.
3. When all devices disappear from the list of Registered Devices (on each device), go to the iCloud System Preferences on your Mac.
4. Click on the Manage button.
5. Click on Tap Forms.
6. Click on the Delete All button. This will delete all the Tap Forms data stored in iCloud. This includes any sync files generated by syncing, photos, file attachments, audio recordings, and drawings. Your database is stored locally, so it won’t affect that. But please make sure you have a backup before doing this.
7. Once all the files are gone from the Tap Forms iCloud area, click on the Enable iCloud Sync checkbox on your Mac.
8. Wait for it to appear. Should happen right away.
9. Go to the iCloud Sync area in Tap Forms on iOS.
10. Tap on the Enable iCloud Sync button. You should have already seen the Mac showing there. The iOS device should also show there now.
11. Look back on your Mac to see if your iOS device shows up there. You may need to close and re-open the popover for the display to refresh.
12. Click on the Sync Now button on your Mac.
13. Wait for the sync to complete on your iOS device. You should see “Processing Changes from iCloud”. If you don’t, then wait longer.
14. Tap on the Sync button on your iOS device. Tap Forms Mac should eventually show the syncing message.

That’s it.

To look at the files that are being generated each time you sync, please visit this folder on your Mac:

~/Library/Mobile Documents/FXLPHZS84D~com~clickspace~tapforms

You can get there by using the Finder’s “Go to Folder…” menu item under the Go menu. Just copy and paste that path in there.

Inside that folder is your Documents, a device identifier file, and the SyncDocuments folder. Open up the SyncDocuments folder and you’ll see the files being created when your device gets registered and when you click and tap on the sync now buttons on each device.

I hope this helps you out.

Thanks,

Brendan

[Brendan]

One more thing… nothing can happen until the TFSyncDoc files get fully downloaded from iCloud. You will see a progress bar to the right of each file as it’s being downloaded from iCloud to your Mac. So if you’re wondering why your Mac hasn’t synced yet, then that’s why. Once the sync file is fully downloaded, you’ll see the Mac start to process the sync files.

The same thing is happening on your iOS devices. You just can’t see that folder. Well, not without using a tool like iExplorer (http://www.macroplant.com/iexplorer)

Thanks,

Brendan

[jsutton]

My syncing is working now, at least with my test forms. I need to throw an ipad and mpro into the mix next.

[Brendan]

Hi J,

That’s great to hear!

Brendan

[Mattapper]

I had also syncing problems and figured out what worked for me.
First, i disabled the iCloud Sync on all devices (iPhone, iPad, iMac). Then on the iPhone i used the “Reset iCloud Sync” function and then enabled the Sync again on the iPhone. After a while i enabled the Sync on the other devices and now it works for me.

But there is one thing to remember – if i made changes on any device i have to start the iCloud sync after that manually to propagate my changes to the other devices. So if i make changes on all 3 devices i have to start the sync on each. So if you edit the same field i a form on more then one device, the first one which sends it to the cloud wins.

But sometimes the Mac-app got stuck and the sync was not submitted.
Until now i was not able to find out how to reactivate the iCloud Sync in the Mac App…
(Sometimes it happens to work again.)

[Brendan]

Hi Mattapper,

Yes, Tap Forms works on a manual push, automatic pull system. That means that whenever you make a change on one device that you’d like to appear on another device, you must tap / click on the Sync button on the device you made the changes on. Then the other devices will pick up those changes automatically. There’s no need to tap / click on the Sync button on the other devices to have them update.

I may change this behaviour in a future update so it’s more automatic.

Thanks,

Brendan

[rleathen]

Brendan I tried exactly what you suggested and while my two ios devices synced they still are not in sync with TF on the mac.

I am very very frustrated at this point. Do you have any other suggestions.

Rob

[Brendan]

Hi Rob,

If all the steps I outlined aren’t working for you then it’s time for a screen share with me.

Are you available for that?

Contact me on email at support@tapforms.com for details.

Thanks,

Brendan

[Roo]

I find it can take some time for iCloud to register the syncs. I am only using an iPhone and iPad but being in Australia it is using iCloud at a different time to most of you guys which may or may not make a difference. Two months ago it could take a whole day to register a change but now it usually syncs within an hour or two. However I leave it overnight to be sure.

[Brendan]

Thanks for chiming in Roo. That part of the process is out of my control unfortunately. All I’m doing is writing a file to the Mobile Documents (iCloud) folder on the device. Then it’s up to the operating system to take over the file from there and upload it to iCloud. When you see the status bar saying “Pushing Changes to iCloud”, that’s all I’m doing. Writing a file. The operating system then kicks in and uploads that file to Apple’s iCloud servers. Then it’s up to their servers to send a notification to all your other devices saying a file has been uploaded. However, that doesn’t mean the file is actually there on your device. Only the metadata gets sent there first. Kind of like a placeholder for the file. Then Tap Forms gets notified about that pending file. The app can tell if the file has been downloaded or not. If not, then it explicitly asks the operating system for it to be downloaded. If the file doesn’t get downloaded, there’s nothing Tap Forms can do with it. When it eventually gets downloaded, I get another notification saying the file is downloaded. At that point I can process it. That’s when you either see the device get displayed in the list of registered devices or the “Processing Changes from iCloud” message appear in the status bar.

At that point, everybody is happy. Hopefully :-)

Thanks,

Brendan

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